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Post by hawke on Apr 21, 2024 16:51:59 GMT
I don't know why proper batsmen self-destruct as soon as number 11 walks in. Edwards showed he could bat defensively last season. On our three test batsmen, they have scored 79 between them in 6 completed innings. If someone like Luxton or Duke should do that, they would be banished to the 2s for ever. Average 13.17? Not 1st XI quality. Obviously. Stoneman out. Yes I looked at those figures too and when you add Lythi it’s 95 from 8 innings. Dearie me. Recruitment Recruitment Recruitment. Essex and Surrey seem to get it right more often than not. Much more often than us.
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Post by davemorton on Apr 21, 2024 17:51:10 GMT
Z Crawley has amassed 5 and 4 for Kent, who are getting stuffed, and Lees 6 and 4 for Durham, who have won. Duckett seems not to be playing, but Joe Clarke has 200 for Notts. Most of the other contenders are in the IPL, I presume. Pope scored 11 and 11 against Somerset, but has been pulled out of the Kent game by the ECFB, according to Kenny Shovel.
Good to hear Gus Fraser describe Yorkshire as 'doing more for cricket' than any other County.
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Post by hawke on Apr 21, 2024 18:08:07 GMT
Z Crawley has amassed 5 and 4 for Kent, who are getting stuffed, and Lees 6 and 4 for Durham, who have won. Duckett seems not to be playing, but Joe Clarke has 200 for Notts. Most of the other contenders are in the IPL, I presume. Pope scored 11 and 11 against Somerset, but has been pulled out of the Kent game by the ECFB, according to Kenny Shovel. Good to hear Gus Fraser describe Yorkshire as 'doing more for cricket' than any other County. well said indeed. terrific
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Post by tykemania on Apr 21, 2024 20:13:50 GMT
Not a great day, but not one that should have us all in the depths of despair either; I think this is one of those weeks that you just have to write off to the disadvantage of losing a very important toss, exacerbated by some poor selection decisions.
The Yorkshire innings ended in a bit of a hurry - Hill played a couple of lovely shots in TRJ's first over, then Coad promptly pushed one to gully and hope dissipated. Moriarty battled for a while, but once Mickie came in Hill decided to audition for the T20 side, which kind of annoyed me. Yes, be positive. But positive does not mean trying to hit impossible shots, which Hill did, so much as having a strategy to accumulate quickly. With the field set, he should have been thinking about working the ball through midwicket for twos, maybe forcing Helm to give him something to hit to the shorter off side, then trying the big hit off the legs at the other end. The ball he was out to, he left 15 yards in from the ropes - but at the other end it would have been on the top tier.
Moan over.
We actually bowled ok. Coad got Stoneman early - an LBW no less - and Thommo bowled a lovely line. As did Hill when he came on. Edwards bowled four insipid overs and was never seen again - the official line is a foot injury and I suppose we should give them some credit etc. Problem was, we had not got enough runs to try anything at all, and Middlesex very sensibly decided on a zero risk crawl to the line.
Conclusions. The toss, noone can really affect. Selection they could. Two error here; firstly, what was Edwards doing here? The captain clearly doesn't fancy him, and he does nothing in the field or with the bat so why not play Revis (or Cliff, Leech etc). The second is Moriarty. I'll preface this by saying I really rate the lad - he is a decent bowler, and will get better with experience, and he is a scrapper wit the bat. But he was only ever going to be a last resort once they'd seen the pitch and forecast. Bess is no worse of a bowler, but does offer something with the bat. If you look at the scorecard, it is not hard to see how Revis and Bess for Edwards and Moriarty might have brought 30-40 more runs an innings without affecting the bowling effort.
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Post by hawke on Apr 21, 2024 20:57:27 GMT
Thanks TM. Really interesting observations.
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Post by davemorton on Apr 21, 2024 20:57:40 GMT
I agree with all of that TM. Balanced and sensible, and true. The selection decision (though we don't necessarily know the full facts), and the toss misfortune, were the two biggest factors.
We failed to select two of our three best seamers, for whatever reason, and if you are going to play a spinner who is unlikely to bowl, better to pick the one who can bat, and field. Bess has at least taken 2nd XI wickets on slow, unhelpful surfaces, and has looked several cuts above all the seamers in those two games, Edwards included.
One question: what has happened to Jafer Chohan? He is 21, so could be on degree exams, for example. I have still never seen him bowl, in the flesh.
Edit: Further to the above, Mr Shovel reports that Milnes/Fisher were rested as a precaution for sore back/shoulder. There is no report of any problem with Revis.
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Post by hawke on Apr 21, 2024 22:13:50 GMT
I can see why they are careful with Fisher and Milnes even if they did not have niggles Their injury records mean it’s best to look after them. Fisher has always been a worry. Glad Coad seems fit.
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Post by newby on Apr 22, 2024 8:07:20 GMT
I can't explain the selection of Edwards so I won't try. Moriarty over Bess may be a little easier, given we have Root and Brook in the side I think the coaching staff may well have felt our batting was strong enough to make the choice on bowling alone and discount Bess's batting credentials.
Wrong as it turned out but that's in hindsight.
Losing the toss was crucial as it turned out, but crucial because none of our top order was able to knuckle down and get us a score in the first or second innings. They should have been able to score at least another 100 runs between them over the two innings and that's being conservative.
Chohan has never played anything but T20 at the top level. He was picked up by a 100 team but didn't play. I've seen him play a few times in the 2nd XI Championship and he wasn't called on to bowl much and didn't seem to be enjoying the fielding all that much either.
I think he is or was studying at Loughborough but I'm not sure he is anything but a T20 player.
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Post by karma on Apr 22, 2024 9:53:12 GMT
I believe Yorkshire conceded 9 lbw (decisions) and Middlesex only 2 , I didn't see much of the livestream and have no reason to question the validity of these.
It's a little time I think since Yorkshire were at Lords (regularly) so possibly our lack of familiarity with the ground (and slope) and Middlesex's regular playing there was contributing factor for batting and bowling in each case.
And our selections and under-performances from the England boys. In this latter area there might have been a belief in the minds of the Yorkshire boys that given our batting line-up, we couldn't lose regardless of how badly we played. Wrong. You've still got to apply yourself!!!
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Post by tykemania on Apr 22, 2024 10:21:54 GMT
The selection of a spinner at this time of the season is always a tricky one, and I get that when they picked a travelling squad the only other evidence from Lords this season was 600 for not many plays 600 for even fewer. Though that was with a kookaburra ball in the freezing cold, and looking at the only used strip on the playing field, with a boundary to the Mound of no more than 35 meters. I just think that the way things ended up, we effectively played with nine men here, carrying two players with no real idea when or how we expected them to contribute to the team.
On the LBW front...I am always loath to be too critical of umpires because I know it can be a difficult job and the Test game with DRS amply evidences just how many genuine mistakes are made. A decent chunk of the gap is accounted for by Higgins bowling at the stumps with some indifferent bounce - Tatts and Tommo first dig were stone dead and, whilst I did not see it live, the general agreement was that Brook got something similar. That said, there were a couple (Lyth first time round, Masood second) where it did seem that the bowler, TRJ both times, was being given every possible benefit of the doubt.
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Post by newby on Apr 22, 2024 12:46:12 GMT
I don't know at what stage Fisher pulled, or was pulled out, but given that he was in the squad, whereas Milnes wasn't, it must have been a very late call.
I can't read the coaches mind but it might have been the case they had taken Edwards for 12 man duties because they wanted the other players to be available for the 2nds game today. That has now been called off for the day by the way.
Not being able to read his mind I don't then know what the thinking then was to go with Edwards rather than Revis.
Last minute injuries, bowlers pulling up during the warm-up, sickness in the camp etc are all things that need to be kept in mind. Perhaps a wiser coach would have taken a 15 man squad all that way, just in case.
It doesn't take away the failure of our much vaunted top order, but it might have helped.
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Post by tykemania on Apr 22, 2024 13:55:00 GMT
Fisher certainly didn't take part in any of the warm ups on day one - and I was there from just after 1000.
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Post by donnylad on Apr 22, 2024 17:31:42 GMT
I think Fisher and Milnes were in doubt from the end of the previous match. Selecting Edwards was ludicrous and ... another foot injury? ? I still think Bess is a better selection than Moriarty .. who I think might have been 'bought' because they thought Bess would leave and having got rid of all the 2nd XI spinners they needed one fast. The batting of the top 5 spoke for itself. Hill is looking to be the best of the lot at the moment. He played as 3rd seamer and was not clouted around - Revis would have been fine in that role. We seemed to give it up and 4 overs from Root and Brook saw the total off rapidly - when did Brook last bowl competitively???
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Post by byased on Apr 23, 2024 8:54:45 GMT
I only saw Fisher bowl a couple of overs in the Gloucester game. He did not seem remotely quick, and action very laboured, so presume he does have a problem. The batting I guess was a straightforward selection. Do the ECB tell Yorkshire to pick "their "players when they are available? My only doubt is whether Root is accepted as part of the team. He chose to play golf rather than cricket for Yorkshire last year, and presumably has income that exceeds most of the others put together. Good for dressing room harmony? I tend to disregard the England players once they are established, as from Gower onwards they more or less admit it is difficult to get motivated playing in from of 500 people when you are used to 25000 or more. He may have been annoyed at getting out, but that is normal for most players. I suppose if he is available he has to be picked on his talent alone, but he has not been an asset in the two games so far. Hopefully next game.
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Post by newby on Apr 23, 2024 9:17:03 GMT
Yes, next game, for Colin, Otis, Yorkshire and St George. Happy St Georges day.
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