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Post by karma on Nov 16, 2023 22:06:32 GMT
It is understood that there will be greater use of the Kookabora ball in the new seasons's Championship to help pace bowlers get ready for bowling overseas for Ashes Tests and and also to aid spinners preparations. It will be used in four rounds of games, double last season
In addition in the Championship it will be 8 points for a draw instead of last season's 5 points. Personally a backward step and I'm not sure but think we'll get more bore draws and potentially more difficult to advance in the championship.
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Post by byased on Nov 16, 2023 23:09:43 GMT
Personally would ban draws, if you can't get a result after four days it is a nonsense. If there has to be a draw, there should be an easy calculation to give a winning and losing draw, with a heavy points advantage to the team who had the winning draw. Most "draws" are not a draw at all, one team is frustrated by the other and scores nowhere near level.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 17, 2023 0:45:07 GMT
The old fashioned way - used in Sheffield Shield - was to decide drawn games on first innings. I think it was 8 points for an outright win, and 5 for a win on first innings. There was a potential downside to this, a long drawn battle for first innings, and the side that won that would not want to lose the actual game over four innings and lose the 5 points gained. But the draw is an historical part of cricket. Some of the greatest games of all time have been draws. Perhaps the most exciting day I ever watched was England batting all day for a draw in Cape Town, then there was Hoggard and Kruis defying Lancashire at Headingley.
If the draw were to be abolished in f-c cricket, that would be the end of my involvement and interest for ever. The game made cheap and nasty.
There is merit in drawing a game, but more importantly there should be a penalty for losing, and the only way you can do that is to give points for a draw. (Or have negative points for losing, which amounts to the same thing.)
I think a simple 3, 2, 1, 0 system would be better than what we have. 3-0 for the win, 2-1 for the draw.
Actually, double everything up: 6, 4, 2, 0 and you would have 6-0 or 4-2, plus 3-3 in the case where there's no result on first innings (a tie or a washout).
Given they're not going to do that, I am glad the points are reverting to 8 for the draw. So you can count that as total disagreement, Byased, no common ground whatsoever!
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Post by byased on Nov 17, 2023 6:57:52 GMT
Not total disagreement. Just that few draws are actually really draws. One team generally trying to win, the other hanging on, and so maybe some allowance for that as opposed to equal points for a "draw". Bonus points for both innings possibly, I never quite understand why they only apply to first innings. Or a winning/losing draw based on net run rate, or something similar, over the four days. I think that would add interest and produce some inventive captaincy and tactics. 8 points each would tend to point to more defensive play, and fewer spectators.
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Post by newby on Nov 17, 2023 9:06:11 GMT
If they want to move to the Kookaburra ball then they ought to just get on with it. Any bowler within a mile of having a chance of playing for England will be attending training camps etc where they can get to practice with any type of ball they like.
Moving back to 8 points for a draw is change for change sake yet again. I give it a maximum of 2 seasons before they change back again when they recognise it encourages teams to cruise along in mid table by preparing flat boring pitches on which taking 20 wickets is nigh on impossible.
I would though like to see a system where the points for a draw are increased if a certain number of overs are lost to the weather.
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Post by tykemania on Nov 17, 2023 10:58:20 GMT
I don't think there is a right answer to this one - I mean, the argument about the weather is of course valid, and having proportionately more points for the draw reduces the inherent randomness of, for example, who is playing at Bristol in April. Equally, it feels wrong in circumstances such as we faced at Hove this year for both sides to walk away with the same when we had basically already won.
Ho hum.
I don't think it will affect us overmuch next year - we already seemed to be playing a lot of teams who were set up to play negatively this year, and our younger players need to learn to find a way to beat such set ups. In Div One where there are relegation places I think it will make much more of a difference; last year there were a disproportionate number of positive results in D1 as against D2.
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Post by newby on Nov 17, 2023 16:55:33 GMT
I'm with you, there's no right answer which is why we will keep flip flopping every couple of seasons.
In a 10 team D1, middling teams who set up not to get beaten at home, can hope to pick up 14 or 15 points against a superior team and keep out of trouble.
I presume bonus points will be remaining the same. They could dispense with bowling bonus points for me.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 17, 2023 17:50:12 GMT
The right answer is, of course, decent pitches, good weather, and a sensible ball. We (they) can do something about the first two, by playing at a sensible time of year, for example, but why would anyone who cares about the game saddle our players with a soft, seamless, dead-bird ball?
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Post by tykemania on Nov 17, 2023 18:49:20 GMT
Moreover, how does bowling with a kookaburra ball at Chester-le-Street on a squally June day in any way prepare you for bowling at the Gabba. With anything?
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Post by karma on Nov 22, 2023 14:00:19 GMT
Apart from, in theory, the questionable help in preparing our bowlers for use with the kookaburra ie for Test play, it has the potential to distort the County Championships. In fact I find this a classic case of the 'tail wagging the dog' and indirectly making winning results in division two harder to achieve
I'm not really bothered about other Div2 teams (or to a large degree about Test Teams) but I am bothered about Yorkshire's chances for promotion to Div1. I say cut points for draws, increase points for wins , throw out the kookaburra and let the CC stand alone rather than being there to produce and support Test Cricket players. Yorkshire First
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Post by newby on Nov 23, 2023 15:49:39 GMT
Along with the release of the fixtures confirmation has also been given about the two rule changes which were leaked earlier, allowing 4 games to be played using the Kookaburra ball and that 8 points will be awarded for a drawn game in the CC are indeed done deals.
Also a rule allowing a bowl off to decide white ball finals in the event that it is not possible to decide the game in any other way.
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