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Post by davemorton on Feb 26, 2024 14:57:15 GMT
I was quite encouraged by England's performance. At least they gave it a go, and if they keep the faith they should gel into an entertaining and successful team. Not this season, though. Ireland are a class above all others. We have a chance against France.
I would like to see Dan as the starting hooker, but that's not going to happen, with George the captain. Feyi-Waboso definitely as a starting winger, and Cunningham-South somewhere in the back row. I would definitely have Mercer at 8, and Earl has been our best back-row forward for a year, now.
Having a runner at scrum-half made all the difference, whether Care or Spencer. The centre combination looked good, and so too Furbank at full-back. There were one or two errors, which proved costly on this occasion, punished by van der Springjock, but stick with this blueprint, Borthwick, and make one old man happy, at least.
Nowt wrong with trench warfare, if that's all you've got, but English rugby is oozing talent at the moment.
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Post by tykemania on Feb 26, 2024 15:49:47 GMT
I think - as someone who watches Sarries most weeks - that Dan is promising but nowhere near ready to start at International level. He does some good stuff, but he is not at George's level as a scrummager, and his lineout throwing needs a lot of work too. Mercer is an odd one - he looked great in France, has not been a quite at the same level for Gloucester but still very decent. Who do you leave out for him? I think personally that Earl has to play, and Barbeary is the man to provide some serious go forward in the tight areas.
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Post by davemorton on Feb 26, 2024 20:33:42 GMT
Back row riches, despite the disappearance of Willis and the retirement of Lawes. They've gone for Roots as the nearest like-for-like they can get for Lawes, Earl must play, and for me Mercer would make the other slot, with Cunningham-South, Underhill and Barbeary (if fit) on the bench. It could be flexible in this area, they're all good players, and each brings something different. Then there's Curry, if and when he recovers. It's all about finding a balance that works, and a bit of horses for courses, with so much talent.
I just think that Mercer and C-South bring an X-factor to what had become a boring team. So does Dan, but I accept his throwing in is inferior to George's, and of course his experience is miles down. With Itoje beginning to shine again, our pack looks good in the loose. I am less sure about the front five in the tight.
I think we're very close to having a good team. We don't have to go all-out Bazball, with loads of experience and/or ability at 8, 9 and 10. But let's not be frightened of flair, either, as represented by Dan, Mercer, C-South, Care or Spencer, 2 Smiths, Lawrence, F-Waboso, Furbank. That's half a team of virtuoso piano players.
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Post by newby on Feb 27, 2024 9:29:24 GMT
I'm sure none of the players named are bad players and of course those watching the Premiership will have their views and favourites. As someone who really only watches the 6 nations and the Autumn Internationals it's just 15 players against 15 players to me.
Could we be falling foul of having too many players who are good enough, without having any who are better than that, who pull the strings, who never get lost in a sea of players, who are willing to try the unorthodox. We certainly don't have a Finn Russell.
Nobody seemed to have time on Saturday for me, players were just making panicky offloads and gifting the ball to Scotland. Even players such as Dan Cole with a cupboard full of caps. The attacking intent crumbled in the face of a good solid defence, just as the defence crumbled when a piece of off the cuff magic from Scotland left them floundering and flat footed.
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Post by slowleftarmer on Feb 27, 2024 9:43:58 GMT
I think that would be my read of the England situation with so much strength in depth that the key thing is finding the best combination so the overall team output is greater than the sum of the individual parts. So this puts more pressure on Borthwick and co to select the right team and not just the best players.
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Post by donnylad on Feb 27, 2024 20:03:11 GMT
I like the look of that side. I think Smith M may get the nod next time if (fully) fit.
The centres were dross on Saturday. I don't know if Lawrence was rushed back too quickly but Slade is a show pony and doesn't live up to the show.
The 'man of the match' in the Wales game (Roots) looks like another tear-away back row who is quick enough to get there but isn't sure what to do when he arrives. Good in broken play but doesn't laik when the dirty work has to be done. It is worrying that the two best scrumagers are the 2 old men of the front row, Marler and Cole and they get panned for 'not doing enough round the field'.
I watched the u-20s the night before - talk about big lads ... England had 2 locks, a number 8 and and open side who looked around 18 stone , 6 foot six and could run with a couple of Scots lads hanging off their legs ..... I believe all four 18 or 19 years old.
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Post by tykemania on Feb 27, 2024 22:02:19 GMT
A slightly different take on England's issues - whilst we have some excellent/promising players, we have a very uneven depth map. As we have evidenced above, we have excellent depth in theory for the back row - in addition to those we have mentioned (Roots, Underhill, Earl, Cunningham-South, Mercer, Tom Curry, Barbeary) we could just as easily have mentioned whichever of Martin and Chessum is not amongst the locks, as well as Tom Willis, Dombrandt, Tom Pearson, Ben Curry and so forth. We are equally flush with options in the back three (Freeman, Steward, Feyi-Waboso, Furbank, Radwan, Watson, Daly, Roebuck) BUT (and the capitals are deliberate) we have almost no options at 13 and if someone can even name me an English number 12 in the Premiership I'd be amazed (aside from Tompkins and Redpath, both now playing for other nations) so myriad 10s and 13s are forced into the hole.
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Post by davemorton on Feb 27, 2024 23:26:44 GMT
I go back to the days when centres used to play left and right, so I tend not to think in terms of 12 and 13. I am not even sure you always want your ball-player at 12 and your basher at 13; it works well the other way round too. Which way round did Carling and Guscott play? Did they always play the same way?
There's a minimum job requirement for a centre: he must be able to tackle, run and pass. You also want one who can kick, preferably with the opposite foot to the 10, and being big is always better than being small. At least one of them should be able to beat an opponent with footwork.
So Ford and M Smith are ruled out because they're not big enough to tackle, for all their bravery. Farrell was useless because he can't run, and has zero footwork, and Tuilagi because he couldn't and wouldn't pass. I was a big Marchant fan, but he has made himself unavailable, and (as a closet Exeter supporter) I have a great liking for Slade, who for me ticks all the boxes, including the auxiliary kicking at 10. The new-born Lawrence, whose ability has been released by the great players round him at Bath, would be my other choice. I have no idea what numbers they wear for their clubs. They should be able to interchange anyway, which was the beauty of the left-right system, plus you got used to playing with the same winger outside you.
Daly gives another option, but I doubt his heart for tackling, and Freeman has being playing centre for Northampton. I must admit I never even noticed Dingwall in those games.
I also watched the U20 matches on Friday night, all three of them, eventually, as they're available on iPlayer. The Scotland v England game was utterly dire, for which I blame the awful plastic 3G pitch near Murrayfield. It was very windy, the pitch was waterlogged and the ball wet, and the result was a shambles of a game, with 32 penalties awarded, as scrums collapsed and the ball bounced extravagantly all over the place. It made good players look poor. The best game was France v Italy, on a grass pitch. Ireland v Wales was one-sided. There was a prop, Patrice Bell, who is from the Isle of Man originally, and has been playing for Sedgley (on loan from Sale Sharks), and he damaged the Wales pack considerably. He doesn't seem to get much actual game time at Sedge.
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Post by karma on Feb 29, 2024 20:41:31 GMT
"Tickets are free, with the exception of a £1 booking charge...." I think I would pay that, if I lived near York. I have watched practice-days before cricket matches, and felt I have gained a few insights. NEW RECORD FOR LNER COMMUNITY STADIUM YORK The stadium, home to York City Football Club and York City Knights Rugby League Club is about to reach a new high. It opened in 2021 and attendances for games have been good , particularly for York City following their move from the old Bootham Crescent Stadium ( now as recently outlined by hawke, gone and replaced by houses). There have been a couple of games with attendances in the High 7,000's Tomorrow, Friday,1st March it will be full with a sell-out crowd of 8,500 sports fans watching England's 2024 Rugby Union Six Nations squad, train. That's incredible 👏, shows the pulling power of the squad and interest in 🏉 Union . The weather forecast isn't brilliant but hope it's kind to supporters and players. Can I just ask that the pitch be left in the same condition you find it boys because I'll be there the following day to watch York City? ⚽️
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Post by davemorton on Mar 1, 2024 9:35:13 GMT
RU practice can wreck a pitch (more than a match does), especially if you practise multiple scrums and line-outs all in the same spot. One would assume England know this. The players do all play for clubs, and the coaches used to!
Amazing that it's a sell out, even at £1. Somewhere, in an office, there's someone saying, "Bugger! We should have charged them £10."
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Post by newby on Mar 1, 2024 10:58:10 GMT
I suppose some may have booked thinking it was a training game rather than a training session. I suppose a mini game will break out at some stage but I hope they have a rugby man on hand to help the announcer keep people informed of what is going on.
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Post by newby on Mar 10, 2024 8:38:15 GMT
Perhaps we can put part of the unexpected England win over Ireland down to the good people of York for turning out in their numbers to watch a training session.
I don't know if getting so many people in to watch them train is normal for England but it can't help but make you think what you're doing means so much to so many people.
I watched most of it again last night and knowing the final result made it easier to see England fully deserved it.
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Post by davemorton on Mar 10, 2024 12:01:02 GMT
Slowly the pieces are coming together, and the bore is going out of Borthwick. Interesting insights from the commentary team, for example that Slade - who is used to the blitz defence at Exeter - is partnering Lawrence, who plays at Bath, where they use the drift system. It is bound to take time to adjust. I thought Feyi-Wabaso made a huge difference, because he is comfortable taking the ball anywhere, even running off 9 or off the forwards into traffic.
He obviously enjoys doing it, and must be a nightmare to defend against, if you're expecting a juggernaut running at you, and suddenly it's a Ferrari!
Perhaps horses for courses in the back row, with Earl nailed on, with an Underhill or Curry type at 7, and either a big lump Chessum or Roots at 6, or the classy pace of Cunningham-South. But please give Mercer a go. There is no answer to pace and, like Earl, he has the lot, the full range of skills.
And play Smith at 10 for the whole game, then perhaps we won't need his rescue act, next time. Already looking forward to next Saturday evening; in Lyon, I think. (More than I'm looking forward to the tram trip to Sale in the afternoon.)
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Post by newby on Mar 10, 2024 18:43:48 GMT
Is Marcus Smith big enough to play International Rugby! He seems to get flattened so easily, and trying to stop Lowe's second try he might as well have not been on the pitch. 'm not convinced.
Furbank I'm coming round to, perhaps he's improving, as of course he should, but he only knocked on the once that I noticed yesterday and his try more than made up for that.
Looking forward to next Saturday, something on all the games even if it's seeing who gets the wooden spoon.
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Post by slowleftarmer on Mar 11, 2024 8:02:12 GMT
Well rugby weekends don't get much better do they - a last gasp but fully deserved win for England and then defeats for Ireland Scotland and Wales with all of their vocal fans very quiet and keeping low profiles - at least one lot of them are usually making noises and gloating!
It has to be good for the game for Italy to now be more competitive but the demise of the Welsh is a concern. They cannot even cling on to some of their best players who prefer to go and try American Football and with the sad passing of so many of their greats, its a sad time for Welsh rugby. Wheeling out Max Boyce beforehand worked for half a game but perhaps they should have then got Tom Jones doing a duet with Shirley Bassey at half time to try and keep up the momentum that disappeared rapidly in the second half when a young experimental French team were rampant.
I wonder how many Irish folk had already started celebrating a 6 nations title win as the clock hit 80 minutes only to then see their defence concede penalties and crumble!
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