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Post by hawke on Nov 25, 2023 20:03:36 GMT
Gosh Dave your boys are doing well in the higher division. Have you signed new players?
Ilkley's league had a rest day. You must be looking at next week's fixtures.
I went to Otley. Both teams threw the ball around and both made many mistakes, especially in the first half which ended 22-38 !! Sheffield, who seemed to have the heavier and stronger pack, went three scores ahead in the 2nd half and appeared on course for a comfortable win but Otley pulled 2 back and were on the Sheffield line in the final minutes, having a possible penalty try not given.
Not sure how Otley pay their players with crowds of about 300, similar to amateur Ilkley a division below. Perhaps it’s lunches and the bar. It was Ladies Luncheon Day. Packed out.
They are not spending money on the ground which is a tired Old Lady. They are hoping Leeds Council makes a positive decision about a road proposal next month which will give them the go ahead to start building an out of town ground. The sale for Cross Green is agreed for housing/care home. I was told this by an Otley supporter who said they would then be nomads for a year. They had hoped to use West Park Bramhope but Leeds Tykes are now there. They have approached Ilkley but, according to this source, were quoted £30,000 to share for the season.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 25, 2023 20:34:51 GMT
WE also get around 300 at Sedgley. The idea seems to be to have a lot of smaller sponsors, and good matchday hospitality. However we do it, it's working up to now. There's no guarantee for the future. One bad decision in committee can sink you, but at least I think we are not vulnerable if one major sponsor pulls out.
It seems we pay well, and on time, and players want to play for us. There seems to be a good spirit. Sign good players, yes, but good people, more importantly. Our leadership group is very strong, and our coach - from Wasps, but now full-time with us - is obviously outstanding. He is a Lancashire man, and was working part-time with Sedge before Wasps folded.
The trick will be to sustain it when coach and players move on, as they will, inevitably. A couple of good older players retired when we got promoted, but we have more than replaced them. Good players want to play for Sedgley, at the moment, and we seem to be rotating our squad quite nicely. There were some unfamiliar names at Cinderford today, including the guy who got sent off, but also a very strong core of ability and experience.
One thing that does help at National League level is rolling substitutes, so you can introduce a player early, and pull him off again, if necessary. A rugby league idea, and a good one.
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Post by newby on Nov 25, 2023 22:43:52 GMT
Sedgley have won 8 and lost 3 the same as the three clubs above them in the table. Sedgley are fourth only because they haven't picked up as many Try bonus points as Rams, Chinnor and Plymouth Albion. Should they end up at the top of the tree do Sedgley have the facilities to take the step up to the Championship!
If they did would it be a blessing or a curse.
Cambridge who went up last year look to be finding it a bit of a struggle.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 25, 2023 23:43:08 GMT
The Championship is a bit of a hotch-potch, with famous old clubs, like Coventry and London Scottish. Then there is Nottingham, who have moved from their traditional home since last we played them. There's Bedford Blues, who have got an old fashioned but large set-up, in spectating terms. Cornish Pirates, as Penzance & Newlyn, were also very strong at that just-below-top level.
At the other end of the scale, there's Caldy, whose facilities I imagine Ilkley would laugh at. It was a traditional grammar school old boys' club, with a wooden pavilion overlooking a cricket square, with rugby pitches too. Old Caldeians, they were called, the school was Caldy Grange.
I assume Ealing, with their immense sponsor Trailfinders, will have excellent modern facilities, as Doncaster have, though they both failed to meet Premiership criteria. It's just possible there might be a bit of politics going on, as the Prem clubs try to build a ring fence by stealth.
In the next couple of years, something is going to give. There are moves by the Championship clubs for a vote of no confidence, but they need 100 signatures, and there are only 11 of them, following Jersey's demise. Sedgley would probably join in, but why should the likes of Otley or Ilkley give a damn?
Sedgley have been at level 2 before, and we hung in there for five seasons, always just surviving, but with no chance of competing against the big boys: Exeter and Bristol were regulars at the time, and Harlequins and Northampton each had a year before bouncing back up. In the end, we lost our place when they dropped from 16 clubs to 12. It was the same year Exeter got promoted.
It's all a shambles now, and the old arguments are resurfacing about franchises. The Championship clubs have rejected both franchises and ring fencing, in a recent statement, but I fear it's an argument they are going to lose.
I have pasted the statement in the next reply, below.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 25, 2023 23:47:12 GMT
From Cornish Pirates website: The 11 Championship clubs came together today to debate their collective future: whether our league will be best served by capitalising on the potential of its commercial rights and its brand-identity to underpin a truly “whole-game solution” to tier two, or by considering a putative “Premiership 2” based on a franchise model.
The clubs agreed unanimously that they are opposed to the franchise model.
This was concluded against the backdrop of:
our desire to find whole-game solutions rather than creating obstacles within the pyramid of club rugby significant doubt about whether there would ever be promotion and relegation into and from the Premiership – a basic question of fairness our objection to a franchise model which would allow non-meritocratic entry to P2 our unwillingness to commit to a tender process
The Championship clubs also agreed that they would continue discussions with the RFU while simultaneously exploring concrete ways of strengthening our existing league.
Our aim is to sustain a second tier of English rugby that adheres to the following principles:
The Championship will be at the top of the competitive pyramid in England, open to all clubs who have the ability, aspiration and ambition to compete in it
The clubs intend to participate in the most competitive environment possible, with an ultimate objective to reach the very top, assuming there is equitable treatment by those currently controlling that route We intend to be financially sustainable and will rigorously explore and exploit the potential of the commercial rights and brand identity that our league possesses We will offer the highest level of professionalism affordable, aligned with the amateur ethos we hold dear and which is at the heart of the game Through the history of our clubs, we represent the proudest traditions and values of rugby and so we will continue to build our community relationships and encourage rugby at all levels We commit to work with the RFU and PRL to grow the game from the grassroots upwards, with a focus on developing and encouraging young players as part of a pathway to the top. This will feed through into National teams at all levels. We will work with the RPA to set the highest standards for player welfare and education.
We hope and expect that the Rugby Football Union will wish to continue to support our league as part of a whole-game approach to solving the sport’s challenges. This league, as its principles make clear, will fulfil vital roles in the development of the game in England. It would, if permitted, also continue to act as a connecting bridge between the Premiership, the England national set-up and the rest of the sport at National League and all other levels.
We believe this is the only sustainable way forward. It ensures the integrity and the competitive heartbeat of our sport. It will be the best guarantee available for the success of future efforts to improve the quality of play and the quantity of participation, from top to bottom, of English rugby.
On the vexed matter of Promotion and Relegation, we will always believe in the right of the best to rise to the top. At present, the well-identified barriers put in our way make this a pipe-dream, but we will work unceasingly to challenge and correct this.
Along with other observers, we have to acknowledge the position in which the Premiership finds itself, and we all have to find a sustainable way forward. For the National Leagues and below, we would welcome the competition that our vision of the future guarantees, a future based on on-field success.
Having agreed these principles, the Championship clubs have authorised the Executive of the Championship to go ahead with the production of a comprehensive plan for our continuing league, to be presented to other stakeholders in the game as soon as practicable.
We fully appreciate the consequential effects of our decision to reject a franchise system. However, we feel certain that we have taken account of all the key components that can form a successful and sustainable recovery of rugby in this country, at least as far as it concerns the elements of the future that we can influence.
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Post by newby on Nov 26, 2023 9:34:52 GMT
Thanks Dave for the comprehensive reply. The Championship clubs appear to be taking a sensible approach, but it's quite a tightrope they are walking.
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Post by hawke on Nov 26, 2023 10:32:02 GMT
yes appears sensible and logical
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Post by karma on Nov 29, 2023 14:10:22 GMT
While pausing for coffee on such a beautiful, crisp morning walk, I came across a very interesting Times article about Zach Mercer, Gloucester's No8. He's installed an oxygen chamber in his home to speed up his ankle injury recovery. Apparently he was injured at the end of October while scoring a try against Saracens in his third appearance for Gloucester after returning from 2 years abroad at Montpellier. I must admit I didn't recognise the name, assume he is fringe England player but was most interested in what someone would do for their sport and career
The chambers increase the amount of oxygen delivered to the body's tissue and cells to speed up recovery and healing. A Hyperbaric Oxygen Chamber, to give the proper name, for home applications could cost £10,000 - 25,000 and Zach has paid for this himself. This shows an unusual level of commitment and finance. Still you only have one career.
My wife's niece is a teacher in Huddersfield and several years ago, after radiation treatment for throat cancer, and side effects to her jawbone, travelled by minibus every day to Hull with other patients for treatment in a Hyperbaric Chamber (actually used by divers decompressing) and for the same purpose, to aid, as appropriate, recovery and healing. She has subsequently married and has two young children.
I suppose sports science and treatments move at such tremendous pace nowadays and not just cold sponge, ice baths and rest
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Post by davemorton on Nov 29, 2023 16:17:54 GMT
Zach is from Leeds, and his dad was a Kiwi RL International, who settled there - similar to the Stokes story. Zach is a brilliant player, so didn't feature for Eddie Jones. It was said he was too small, so great pace, feet, hands, aggression all counted for nothing. His talents were more appreciated in France, but now he is back...and injured!
Such is life. I assume he will find a second-hand market for his Chamber. One careful owner.
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Post by newby on Nov 29, 2023 17:50:44 GMT
I see that the England captain Owen Farrell is due to sit out the next 6 nations to protect his mental health.
I suspect that news will help to improve your mental health DM.
Has his race been run in terms of representing his country, I think it probably has, he still intends to play for and captain Saracens.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 29, 2023 18:42:58 GMT
My mental health is fine. My temper is something else, and it pained me to see a churlish bully selected ahead of a creative genius. You need a mixture in a rugby team, as in a cricket team. It's probably as wrong to go total Bazball as it is to go total Boycott. In English rugby at the moment we have a surfeit of fast, brilliant wingers and full-backs. We need a creative 10 to release them. You can have a steady 10, as we did with Wilkinson, so long as you've got a creative 9 like Dawson. Add to that a bish bosh bash centre like Tindall, alongside the wonderfully creative Greenwood. With Robinson on the wing, that's a great back line.
We could have equalled that in the last few years, but they went for slow-motion Young at 9, stationary Farrell at 10, and Tuilagi, who was never going to pass a ball, ever, at 12 or 13. They left Slade at home for the World Cup! and Marchant has followed Mercer into French exile, I believe. And the best scrum-half in the country has not even had a look in; that's Spencer, at Bath.
So, for me, that's good news today. Farrell and Saracens are welcome to one another. Smith at 10 and Arundel at 15 will do fine. Or Ford at 10, Smith at 15, fine also. We've about 10 wingers to choose from.
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Post by slowleftarmer on Nov 30, 2023 7:45:20 GMT
You know more about rugby than me Dave, but why do you overlook Freddie Steward at full back as I thought he was nailed on to play there?
I thought Arundel could play on the wing as he did at the World Cup when actually given a chance against the minnow nations?
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Post by davemorton on Nov 30, 2023 11:14:53 GMT
Steward's fine, a big, solid, reliable trad English full-back + a bit more than that. These days they select a back three, with interchangeable wingers and full-back. I would have had Anthony Watson, but he was injured just before the WC, who seems to be solid + X-factor. Lovely player, but getting on a bit.
I am also excited by the idea of Smith at 15, if they're not going to pick him at 10, and Ford is a considerable player. We have so much talent, but you wouldn't have thought it, watching the last couple of seasons.
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Post by newby on Nov 30, 2023 12:01:26 GMT
I felt anxious for Smith when he played at 15 in the World Cup against Fiji. He looks too slight for the position to me.
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Post by davemorton on Nov 30, 2023 13:33:07 GMT
Smith v Ford tomorrow night, Quins v Sale, 19.45 on TNT. Great game expected.
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